Interview with Paul R. Alfonsi, May 27, 1981

Partial Transcript: Born in Pence (Iron County) on February 13, 1908, of Corsican parents. Father came in 1906 to work the iron ore mines. Mother came next year and they were married. Alfonsi educated in Pence public schools and graduated from Hurley High School. Then went to Whitewater State College, graduating in 1927.

Partial Transcript: Started teaching at Washburn High School (Bayfield County, Wisconsin) at age nineteen. Taught commercial subjects and coached debate and forensics.

Partial Transcript: Captained the debate team two of his three years there and was college orator one year. Influenced his interest in politics.

Partial Transcript: At Washburn Alfonsi met Representative Robert Nixon, progressive Republican leader in the Assembly, and became close friends. In 1932 election incumbent from Iron and Vilas counties suffered a stroke. Alfonsi won a five way Republican primary spending $44. Ran a personal door to door campaign and went on to beat the Democrat and an independent Republican.

Partial Transcript: Before 1934 election progressive Republicans decided to form their own party. In three months they had collected several hundred thousand signatures. Alfonsi felt that the new party would clarify progressive position on issues. Rallies during that first campaign were very successful because of the enthusiasm for the new party.

Partial Transcript: 1936 campaign very successful; Progressives elected governor, winning a plurality of forty-six in the Assembly and sixteen in the Senate. Alfonsi became Speaker. In 1938 Progressives hurt by Duncan incident and Phil La Follette's national ambitions. Encouraged Republicans and Democrats to form coalition against Progressives. Alfonsi himself had little trouble in his personal campaigns.

Partial Transcript: Owed his election to the support of labor, especially the miners in Iron County. Spent much of his first term learning rules of procedure--helped by Robert Nixon. Credits his knowledge of rules to much of his legislative success. During his first session sponsored bill compelling the mining companies to establish safety standards for the miners. Also involved in educational and conservation issues.

Partial Transcript: Robert Nixon, Progressive leader in the 1933 session, sent to Washington and Alfonsi became floor for the 1935 session.

Partial Transcript: Jorge Carow (P-Ladysmith), Speaker in the 1935 session, died after the 1936 election. Alfonsi decided to go for the Speaker's chair. Four sought the Progressive Party endorsement and Alfonsi received it on the second ballot. Although there were only 46 Progressives, Alfonsi counted on the support of four Democrats to win 50-49. He also had to use “a little bit of Corsican intuition” to trick one member to change his vote from Victor Nehs to Alfonsi. Being elected speaker one of the proud moments of Alfonsi's career.

Partial Transcript: Progressives only had 46 votes, but Alfonsi appointed Charles Perry, R-West Allis, chairman of Judiciary Committee. Perry controlled six or seven Republican votes but even so Progressive program defeated. That required a special session in September 1937 where the program passed with the help of Perry's Republican votes. Coalition of Democrats and Republicans primarily interested in embarrassing Governor La Follette; they did not care if anything passed or not.

Partial Transcript: Main complaint with La Follette's office was that Assembly leadership not consulted in advance often enough. One specific fight Alfonsi had with La Follette involved a bill Alfonsi drafted on relief payments. La Follette said he supported it but would Alfonsi wait a little. Then Alfonsi found out that La Follette had given the bill to Sen. Philip Nelson, R-Superior, in an effort to get him on the Progressive side.

Partial Transcript: La Follette most astute governor of the state that Alfonsi served under. But unlike his brother Bob, Phil La Follette was opinionated and somewhat egotistical. Bob was the statesman; Phil was the politician. Personalities of both La Follette and Tom Duncan hurt their relationships with legislators but both were respected for their abilities. They kept everything to themselves.

Partial Transcript: No equal. La Follette was a master with a crowd. Made as many as five speeches a day and drew tremendous crowds. Used plain language and gestures to appeal to his audience. His speaking style differed from that of his father Robert M. La Follette Sr. in that old Bob was more of a showman.

Partial Transcript: Alfonsi not involved and attempted to discourage the new party. Alfonsi never understood why Phil La Follette did it, citing all the problems that face a new party, especially in Presidential years and ballot access.

Partial Transcript: Organized at precinct level. Very easy in his home county, Iron County; more difficult in Vilas County, which was conservative. Cites lack of outside distractions on voters which made belonging to a party more attractive. Judge Carter from Eagle River helped organize Vilas County. Held frequent meetings and Alfonsi would come back every weekend. Kept year round headquarters in Iron County, not in Vilas.

Partial Transcript: Alfonsi knew that people had problems who could not get down to Madison so he invited them to see him at home. When he would get home on Fridays there would be a line of cars outside his house. He would then help resolve those problems. This helped Alfonsi keep in close contact with his constituents which paid dividends as it was a form of campaigning year round.

Partial Transcript: Radio out of the question during the thirties and very little newspaper. Mostly personal contact and small card. Iron County a melting pot and many could not speak English. Alfonsi would give them a small card with his name on it which they took with them into polls. Italians and Finns strong supporters because of their gratitude for Alfonsi's help.

Partial Transcript: Primarily labor but not organized in the early thirties. Alfonsi's father did not belong to the union and refused to work for the WPA. He went out into the woods and cut wood instead.

Partial Transcript: When Alfonsi first came to the legislature, Highway 77 out of Hurley was not paved, just covered with slag rock, creating a large dirt problem. Highway Department refused Alfonsi's request to oil the road so he introduced a bill forcing them to do it. The bill passed and the road became known as Alfonsi Highway.

Partial Transcript: 1932 campaign had cost $44.00 and most later campaigns cost around $1500 or $1600. Only one campaign cost more than $2000. Most contributions from friends and supporters. (This may include campaigns in the 1950s and 1960s as much as the 1930s.)

Partial Transcript: 1938 meeting at Pence with Bob La Follette. Had arranged for parking for about 1000 people but 3000 came. People were parking a mile away and walking. In 1936 Phil La Follette spoke to about 700 people in Pence. Ralph Immell, Barney Gehrmann also spoke. Local candidates would also be introduced at these meetings and they could speak if they wanted. Meetings mainly speeches though sometimes there would be beer.

Partial Transcript: Progressive Party at low ebb in 1940. Republican Julius Heil running for a second term. Former Attorney General Orland Loomis considered frontrunner. Former Lt. Governor Henry Gunderson (P-Portage), a man from Eau Claire [whose name Alfonsi could not recall], Alfonsi, and Sen. Philip Nelson from Superior also in the race. Alfonsi supporters felt Nelson was in the race to divide Northern vote. Alfonsi spent $2400 which was not enough for a gubernatorial race. Alfonsi also hurt by Italy joining the Axis and the image of Mussolini. Heil defeated Loomis in 1940 but Loomis won election in 1942. Alfonsi supported him and was slated to become his executive secretary but Loomis died of a heart attack before taking office.

Partial Transcript: Alfonsi felt they were big help to the Party but was not active in the Federation. Was close to Amlie and supported him in the 1938 U.S. Senate primary.

Partial Transcript: Basically occurred in the years after Alfonsi left the area and led to Democratic Party inroads in Iron County.

Partial Transcript: Alfonsi did not associate with the group, feeling that some of them would be of no help to his people. As a whole they did not do the prestige of the party any good.

Partial Transcript: Evjue always said he wanted to keep the party honest. Alfonsi found him inconsistent; was not one of the men he admired.

Partial Transcript: A warhorse who did not get the credit he deserved.

Partial Transcript: A nice old man.

Partial Transcript: Did outstanding job for the party and many of them later elected to office. Many times crucial to the success of the party.

Partial Transcript: The need for the Progressive Party declined because the conservative wing of the Republican Party became more liberal and closer to the Progressives. Right now Wisconsin is a moderate Republican state and the differences between parties much less than in 1934 when the Progressive Party was formed.

Partial Transcript: No regrets. Progressives firmly committed to fiscal responsibility. La Follette would submit three budget proposals, A, B, and C reflecting differing levels of expenditures, but he would not sign an unbalanced budget. Progressives stood for what Alfonsi still believes in. He is a fiscal conservative, but his heart bleeds for those who need help through no fault of their own.

Partial Transcript: Miles McMillan criticized him for not running as Democrat, but Alfonsi has no regrets returning to Republican Party.

Partial Transcript: Alfonsi had no interest in any of them and disapproved of them. Endorses two party system. Third and fourth parties weaken the issues and confuse the voters.

Partial Transcript: Joining the Progressive Party did not deprive one of acting as Democrat or Republican in Presidential contests. Also the conservative wing of the Republican Party had become so haughty it practically forced the progressive Republicans out. Alfonsi did not want to be a mugwump anymore.

Partial Transcript: Alfonsi supported Roosevelt in 1932 and 1936 but supported Wilkie in 1940.

Partial Transcript: The 1934 elections reflected the split in the Republican party while time allowed the Republicans to recover their strength. In the 1950s the Republicans abused the rules of fair play and paid for it in the 1970s.

Partial Transcript: Emil Costello of the CIO and Kenneth Hones of the Farmer's Union both personal friends of Alfonsi. They may have attended Communist meetings but they were fine gentlemen and spoke for their constituencies. The issue was used against Alfonsi by Evjue and McMillan.

Partial Transcript: No effect at all in the state. Walter Graunke from Wausau supported their ticket. Graunke “sometimes went off the deep end but was a good warhorse.”